Help with interpreting Tunerstudio settings

[Frogcow]

Am I interpreting this parameter input correctly ?

In regards to Trigger Offset (deg) - This engine has a cam driven distributor with internal VR sensor, 24-1 trigger wheel, there are four actual teeth between the missing tooth and where the tooth at TDC mates with the VR sensor. Ignition Input capture is set to rising edge.
360°/24t = 15° 15° x 4.5t = 68° Camshaft 68° x 2 = 136°

cam trigger wheel.png

[Frogcow]

I have had a hard time trying to troubleshoot a no start condition on my Daihatsu Charade, I am now beginning to wonder if the 2.920 code supports a cam driven vr sensor (24-1 toothed wheel) alone to control engine timing.

I have spent countless hours reading through both the megamanual and the ms-extra manual, previous posts on both forums and other forums, I have searched google for assistance including images and youtube videos.

I am at the point now where I am just putting random numbers into Tunerstudio Ignition settings to try to get it to catch.

Is anyone else triggering from a cam driven sensor to control timing on B&G code?

I have had two occasions over the weekend where the engine (just for a second) tried to start but other than that its all starter motor.

Appreciate any guidance.

[Frogcow]

Here is an .msq and .msl

[trakkies]

Interesting question. It's an unusual setup, I'd say, and perhaps the code won't cope with that trigger wheel at cam speed.

Would it be possible to remove a tooth opposite the missing one so there are two? Then treat it as a 12-1 crank sensor?

But not certain that would work, either.

[Frogcow]

Yes it appears that would work, I have a 36-1 crank wheel I could have a go at installing if it doesn't.

I just want to see it run again.

[Frogcow]

So I have ground off another tooth to make it appear like a 12-1 wheel to the Megasquirt.

Still wont start. Could someone please, please look at my datalog, I think there might be interference on the rpm signal, it appears to be reading a lot higher all of a sudden, 5-10x higher. In previous datalogs it hovered around 200rpm, now it appears to be more around 1000.

I have the trim pots R52 + R56 turned to the fully counterclockwise positions. I dont have a scope but will invest in one if it will help.

Please advise

[Frogcow]

I have had a look on the net and there are some diy oscilloscope kits that can be purchased for under $30.

Also I mapped out my trigger wheel a bit better. I just wanted to post this up to see if I am on the right track with these settings

[kjones6039]

I have a 36-1 crank wheel I could have a go at installing if it doesn't.

What is keeping you from using it? Seems a lot simpler!

Ken

[Frogcow]

Thanks for your reply Ken,

I would like to utilize the below pictured 36-1 trigger wheel. It would be mounted to the crankshaft pulley as per the picture. However I am unsure about what vehicle it came off so I am unsure how to get a sensor for it.

[trakkies]

So I have ground off another tooth to make it appear like a 12-1 wheel to the Megasquirt.

Still wont start. Could someone please, please look at my datalog, I think there might be interference on the rpm signal, it appears to be reading a lot higher all of a sudden, 5-10x higher. In previous datalogs it hovered around 200rpm, now it appears to be more around 1000.

I have the trim pots R52 + R56 turned to the fully counterclockwise positions. I dont have a scope but will invest in one if it will help.

Please advise

According to your log, you are getting a tach signal as it is reading RPM. Assuming that is cranking RPM, is it a bit high at 1000rpm max if the engine isn't firing? I'd expect less than half that with a starter motor - but don't know your engine. Just wondered if you have it set for a crank rather than cam trigger?

(think you select this under Dual Spark ignition options - but not 100% sure as I've never used this setup.

[kjones6039]

I can't open your images! Any suggestions?

Ken

[trakkies]

I can't open your images! Any suggestions?

Ken

It's Photo Bucket. They have stopped free third party hosing. I've changed to ImgBB which works in about the same way.

[Frogcow]

My current settings in TS for ignition
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AiK2iBea_TQriCIGGvFJD8FK__UO

Crank 36-1 unidentified trigger wheel
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AiK2iBea_TQriCM2rihu3ZhoiV3I

Dave: Yes the cranking RPM is around 200 rpm . This is something I cant explain, I never touched the Dual spark option as the helpful hint says it is only for Microsquirt.

Ken: The vr sensors online seem to list the car that the sensor is found on and not much else. I can measure the teeth width. I was hoping someone might recognise this wheel, also I have had trouble finding shielded twisted cable for the VR sensor locally, it would be good to get a nice long harness with a suitable sensor.

[trakkies]

Think we need an expert to reply to this. Most trigger wheels are crank driven. I''d expect MS to default to that. But needs to be told if you're using a cam speed trigger only.?

[Frogcow]

Hi Guys

I had another attempt at starting today, please find my latest .msl and .msq.

I will recheck getting spark and fuel after latest changes next. I haven't tried injector test mode and I am one of the 99.9% who didn't bench test the injectors.The spark plugs appear drier than I expected but do smell of fuel.

[trakkies]

IMHO you will never get it to run (or at least reasonably well) until the RPM figure shown in a log is true RPM. Just about everything MS controls depends on this.

[Frogcow]

Yes the RPM is not right, I think I am on the right track though, just found out there is only 1 ohm across the terminals of my fuel pump, the fuel pump that shares positive with the injectors, coil and LC2 hence no spark or fuel on the last starting attempt.

This fault reared its head a while back but appears to be intermittent. It was a second hand pump purchased online.

https://1drv.ms/i/s!AiK2iBea_TQriCQSoOl3YMUr3Gyi

[trakkies]

Can you hear the pump run when you switch on? You may have to get close to it to be certain and get someone to switch on for you. It should run for a couple of seconds then stop.

BTW, most DVMs don't measure very low resistance accurately. And 1 ohm at 12v would be 12 amps.

Better to measure how much current it draws and check against the maker's spec.

[Frogcow]

Okay so chased my tail a bit however have finally overcome the no fuelling issue.

The bad news is I have temporarily lost spark. Following on from the previous post the RPM on the log has now dropped to ~700 which I feel is still too high. I have 12 volts at the +ve side of the coil, I have continuity from the distributor VR sensor on the ground and signal wire all the way back to the MS2. The coil is new, the leads and plugs are new.

The fuel pump has been replaced with a new one. I can confirm that I have pump priming pulse, pump vibration on cranking, fuel in the cylinders and ~35psi in the supply line. I have charged the battery which is holding 12.4V. I have attached an MSQ and MSL for your attention.

[Frogcow]

I reflashed the firmware and my spark has returned.

Now I just found a good writeup on the trigger settings in a manual named autotrigger for Microsquirt.

Apparently I have been counting the teeth between tdc and the tach signal anticlockwise when I should have been counting them clockwise because my wheel is on the end of the cam not the front. It was the whole viewed from behind thing that confused me so I will change trigger angle to 195 degrees and give it another go.